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Old 05-22-2011, 02:51 PM   #1
Cohort
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Default From Avid Media Composer to Edius? Maybe?

Hi Guys,
I'm new at this forum but not new to Canopus hardware, I had a DVStorm back in 2000-2001 I think it was?, a great piece of hardware that worked really well with Prem 6/6.5, unfortunately I did drop canopus all together and ended up on Pinnacle/Avid Liquid for 4 years and then Avid media composer for 5 years and in between used FCP to help edit some short films for friends and co.

I have a soft spot for Canopus & thought I would come over and have a look at the grassvalley site and see whats been happening lately, I haven't seen or looked at any Canopus/GrassValley stuff for years!...so I downloaded Edius demo v6 to give it a shot......I'll start with the cons (not many by the way) or maybe these are not cons and can be done in Edius & I just have to read the manual but here we go....

in trim mode:
01: how can you shorten the looped playback of the cut area? (seems to play to much video before the cut).
02: also is there a keyboard short cut to play looped play back of the cut area only?
03: when using keys 'A' & 'S' to go to edit points while in trim mode it does not stay in 'trim' to the edit point you jumped to, the trim remains at the initial edit point you turned it on at? it would be better if the trim mode stayed with you as you jump to edit points up and down the timeline.
04: keyboard short cut to open trim mode is F6 can this be changed to different keys? I cant seem to find where to change this in the user settings.

*IMPORTANT: The trim mode and trim functions must work 100% on keyboard, it is vital for me as I am a keyboard editor not a 'mouse' 'drag and drop guy' editor.

*IMPORTANT: Keyboard shortcuts, 'custom keys assigning' must be really good, as good as Media Composer at least. as above, I'm a keyboard editor.
I've had a look you cant seem to change modes eg change F6 trim editor to something else.

05:Full Screen playback correctly with one stroke keyboard short cut? I found it in user settings but when I activate it, it goes to full screen but it still shows the timeline? what am I doing wrong here? (I would like to have 1 keyboard shortcut that goes into full screen playback in either source and record, what ever window I'm working on)

06:how do you re-position something in 3D space?

07: if loading audio file to source monitor can you see waveform? (I haven't imported audio file yet sorry)

08: divider between audio and video tracks on the timeline is a little strange, as you need to slide arrows up and down after stretching audio out to see your video again.

*I could be wrong with some of the above stuff as I have not read the Edius manual but my first impression is the TRIM MODE/EDITOR needs some work/enhancements....some of the avid guys would tell you the same thing the trim mode in media composer is second to none in speed and functionality, I have used ALL the NLE's on this planet professionally and the media composer trim editor is the best, and divider between video and audio tracks in timeline does not feel so good.

*Now the PROS!
Great user interface, excellent format support, responsive timeline speed and JKL speed, responsive over all app speed, export to DVD very handy, 'enhanced proxy mode' this looks very very cool!!!, good redraw on audio waveform in timeline, edius is a great NLE, I would love to put forth feature enhancements and editing/trimming enhancements requests as I've used every NLE professionally under deadline pressure and I know all the pros and cons of all of them, (I was a beta tester for Avid Liquid) I would consider switching to Edius as it is close to being a very high level NLE.

*please do not take the things I said in 'CONS' to heart as I have not read the manual so go easy on me.... but as a professional editor the above cons stand out when diving straight in to Edius and like I said there are not many cons, I'll keep bashing away at Edius and probably solve half those things anyway!

I'll let you guys know how I go.

Cheers.
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Old 05-22-2011, 03:54 PM   #2
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Hi Tim.

We have now completed 2 features all edited on Edius. Our main Editor is a guy with a billion years of Avid experience. He had a little time getting used to Edius, but with some set up changes and keyboard re-arrangements, it is now second nature to him. So much so that he has borrowed one of our systems to work on, instead of his Avid.

This may be a good indicator for you. And besides, looking at your profile you're based in Australia. From what I see on the forum, Edius is the official national editing platform for Australia and New Zealand, so you will be in safe hands :)


Cheers.

Dave.
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Old 05-22-2011, 05:38 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
Hi Guys,
I'm new at this forum but not new to Canopus hardware, I had a DVStorm back in 2000-2001 I think it was?, a great piece of hardware that worked really well with Prem 6/6.5, unfortunately I did drop canopus all together and ended up on Pinnacle/Avid Liquid for 4 years and then Avid media composer for 5 years and in between used FCP to help edit some short films for friends and co.

I have a soft spot for Canopus & thought I would come over and have a look at the grassvalley site and see whats been happening lately, I haven't seen or looked at any Canopus/GrassValley stuff for years!...so I downloaded Edius demo v6 to give it a shot......I'll start with the cons (not many by the way) or maybe these are not cons and can be done in Edius & I just have to read the manual but here we go....

in trim mode:
01: how can you shorten the looped playback of the cut area? (seems to play to much video before the cut).
This depends on what you use.

If you use loop playback the lenght is dependent on the in and out points you put.

If you use play are around cut point the length is 1,2 and 3 seconds.
(I will get back to you on adjusment bit IIRC these are preset) shortcut comes up when you hover default "/"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
02: also is there a keyboard short cut to play looped play back of the cut area only?
Yes loop is ctr+space bar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
03: when using keys 'A' & 'S' to go to edit points while in trim mode it does not stay in 'trim' to the edit point you jumped to, the trim remains at the initial edit point you turned it on at? it would be better if the trim mode stayed with you as you jump to edit points up and down the timeline.
Use page up and down

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
04: keyboard short cut to open trim mode is F6 can this be changed to different keys? I cant seem to find where to change this in the user settings.
Yes User settings-> user interface-> keyboard shortcut
type "trim mode" in the filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
*IMPORTANT: The trim mode and trim functions must work 100% on keyboard, it is vital for me as I am a keyboard editor not a 'mouse' 'drag and drop guy' editor.
They work and in EDIUS you don't actually have to go in trim mode to trim.
Many users don't use it. :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
*IMPORTANT: Keyboard shortcuts, 'custom keys assigning' must be really good, as good as Media Composer at least. as above, I'm a keyboard editor.
I've had a look you cant seem to change modes eg change F6 trim editor to something else.
I think that the manual shows this but we have a long list of keys you can change you might get lost. :)
Usersettings-> User interface-> keyboard shorcuts
type: "Trim mode" in the filter to get there faster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
05:Full Screen playback correctly with one stroke keyboard short cut? I found it in user settings but when I activate it, it goes to full screen but it still shows the timeline? what am I doing wrong here? (I would like to have 1 keyboard shortcut that goes into full screen playback in either source and record, what ever window I'm working on)
If you use dual screen it will go fullscreen to one monitor and show what ever is on the second monitor. This is normal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
06:how do you re-position something in 3D space?
Layouter. f7

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
07: if loading audio file to source monitor can you see waveform? (I haven't imported audio file yet sorry)
NO, timeline only

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
08: divider between audio and video tracks on the timeline is a little strange, as you need to slide arrows up and down after stretching audio out to see your video again.
Don't get this can you explain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post
*I could be wrong with some of the above stuff as I have not read the Edius manual but my first impression is the TRIM MODE/EDITOR needs some work/enhancements....some of the avid guys would tell you the same thing the trim mode in media composer is second to none in speed and functionality, I have used ALL the NLE's on this planet professionally and the media composer trim editor is the best, and divider between video and audio tracks in timeline does not feel so good.
We have had many TV stations switch to EDIUS some with 2000 and up licenses. I don't think they have issues with trimming.
But those have had a EDIUS trainer go over to show them how it works.
They are cutting , trimming with a big smile because it is just easier.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cohort View Post

*Now the PROS!
Great user interface, excellent format support, responsive timeline speed and JKL speed, responsive over all app speed, export to DVD very handy, 'enhanced proxy mode' this looks very very cool!!!, good redraw on audio waveform in timeline, edius is a great NLE, I would love to put forth feature enhancements and editing/trimming enhancements requests as I've used every NLE professionally under deadline pressure and I know all the pros and cons of all of them, (I was a beta tester for Avid Liquid) I would consider switching to Edius as it is close to being a very high level NLE.

*please do not take the things I said in 'CONS' to heart as I have not read the manual so go easy on me.... but as a professional editor the above cons stand out when diving straight in to Edius and like I said there are not many cons, I'll keep bashing away at Edius and probably solve half those things anyway!

I'll let you guys know how I go.

Cheers.
Don't know if have seen this document:
http://www.grassvalley.com/docs/Appl...Editors_AN.pdf

There's is a link to videos In the pdf.

Since you are in Australia you could contact forum member Anton Strauss (AntonsVideo). He will have you "converted" in a day. :)
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Last edited by GrassValley_SL; 05-23-2011 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 05-22-2011, 07:00 PM   #4
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Steve has answered most of your questions. I would like to throw in that you really don't need to get into Trim mode at all. Pretty much everything there can be accomplished on the timeline in "Normal" mode. Check out the manual and it can give you the steps for any kind of roll, trim, slide, slip, etc edits you want to do. This is actually one of the Edius strengths is that you can do all of this without having to go back and forth between modes.
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Old 05-22-2011, 07:06 PM   #5
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Hehe I also mentioned that. Thanks for chiming in since you do a lot of the broadcast training in the USA. :)

I think when AViD editors see that they actually don't have to go in a mode the jaws drop. :)
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Old 05-24-2011, 06:26 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Union Films View Post
Hi Tim.

We have now completed 2 features all edited on Edius. Our main Editor is a guy with a billion years of Avid experience. He had a little time getting used to Edius, but with some set up changes and keyboard re-arrangements, it is now second nature to him. So much so that he has borrowed one of our systems to work on, instead of his Avid.

This may be a good indicator for you. And besides, looking at your profile you're based in Australia. From what I see on the forum, Edius is the official national editing platform for Australia and New Zealand, so you will be in safe hands :)


Cheers.

Dave.

Hi Dave
Oh!! I wish. Most are using FCP & or Avid

Regards
Ronnie
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Old 05-24-2011, 09:49 AM   #7
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Cohort.

Take some advise from my little green friend. "You must unlearn what you have learned"


Hi Ronnie.

The dark side is growing weaker :) Any online examples of your electronic music?

Cheers.

Dave.
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Old 05-24-2011, 10:59 AM   #8
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Hi Dave

Yeah!, apparently there is a bit but it is owned by labels now, Remixing and re-programming drums & rythm is my thing. Making club friendly tracks. As I don't own the licence for these I am not free to distribute. But that's going to change after June.
Writing a score at the moment for a feature I am working on.
Regards
Ronnie
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Old 05-24-2011, 04:23 PM   #9
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I have worked for so many years with avid media composer.
From 4 months job with edius Storm 3g Elite.
I'm not very happy about the performances of edius.
Unfortunately I speak badly English. So, I don't succeed in explaining well.

These the negative points of edius:
1 - edius doesn't have the nesting (fantastic function in avid)
2 - Slow motion with fliker (fantastic function in avid)
3 - window of trim complicated.
4 - the media's management imparagonabile to that of avid.
5 - The reaction to the commands with edius is rapid and immediate if it works with only software.
With the card the answer to the commands it is slow and everything results late.
(I have tried Storm 3G and Storm 3g elites with 2 different computers but with identical results)
6 - audio mixer and management of the audio volume
7 - Management of the bins (only one)



These the positive points:
1 - Edius has very very effects.
2 - Edius works any file.
3 - Edius exports and imports directly from DVD from and in timeline. (this is fantastic)
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Old 05-24-2011, 04:31 PM   #10
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Maxmi I have send you an pm to which you have not replied.
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