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Old 01-21-2011, 06:07 PM   #1
JoJo Gunn
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Over the last few weeks, I have gained technical knowledge by reading these forums as well as forums dedicated to home entertainment and equipment. Consequently, I will stay with Edius 5.5 and store the recently purchased Edius 6 on the shelf. There is NO reason to upgrade my NX card to a different card. There is nothing to be gained. The component output is as good as SDI or HDMI as far as video quality. As a matter of fact, it is better if you have a long run. The limiting factor being the RCA connectors (BNC is the professional standard).
I have played with several editing systems now and I do believe that Edius is the best for price vs value. So why in the world did our designers put NX drivers on the back burner?
With three weeks of education and experience under my belt, I am not an expert but I am allowed my opinion.
OK. I have a bottle of Vaseline handy and I am ready for comments!
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Old 01-22-2011, 01:47 AM   #2
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While I agree that component is generally better/easier for longer runs than HDMI, SDI can go very much farther without degradation in the image quality.

You can get the same signal through good RCA connectors as you can through good BNC connectors. Electrically they're the same - it's a signal and ground. BNC is preferred in broadcast installations because it is a locking connector and won't pop off if someone's foot gets stuck on a cable.

Broadcast Composite connections use BNC connectors too, but the signal doesn't look any better than the same using RCA connectors, given the same physical cabling in-between. :)

As for why NX drivers lag behind... Well, many reasons, but an industry example...

iOS update comes out for iPhone 4 first, and the update may or may not make it to iPhone 3, but if it does, it comes later.
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Old 01-22-2011, 03:57 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrassValley_BH View Post
While I agree that component is generally better/easier for longer runs than HDMI, SDI can go very much farther without degradation in the image quality.

You can get the same signal through good RCA connectors as you can through good BNC connectors. Electrically they're the same - it's a signal and ground. BNC is preferred in broadcast installations because it is a locking connector and won't pop off if someone's foot gets stuck on a cable.

Broadcast Composite connections use BNC connectors too, but the signal doesn't look any better than the same using RCA connectors, given the same physical cabling in-between. :)

As for why NX drivers lag behind... Well, many reasons, but an industry example...

iOS update comes out for iPhone 4 first, and the update may or may not make it to iPhone 3, but if it does, it comes later.
A while back, a Sony engineer (old buddy) was in my studio. He was one of the guys responsible for installing high end gear in TV stations around the country.
This is back in analog tape to tape days. When he saw that I was using some RCA cables, he went to his van and came back with BNC cables. My RCA cables were by "Monster" so I was not happy about throwing them out.
He explained about his personal experience and his reasoning. Maybe cable connectors have improved?
Re. the NX drivers: What does Grass Valley expect us to use while we wait.
Maybe they expect us to buy a new card?
No sour grapes just curiosity. I am happy as is.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:08 PM   #4
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On RCA vs BNC, some of it is "about the name" - it's kind of like how buying a Mercedes you get (or at least expect) a higher base level of quality compared to buying say, a Nissan.

RCA cables are generally consumer grade, therefore the testing involved and cheaper quality cable is used.

BNC cables, on the other hand, are generally broadcast grade, therefore testing tolerances are more strict and higher quality cable is used, and there is generally more consistency in build (important when you're mixing tens or hundreds of cables).

My point is though, it's not the connector itself. It's everything else. It is just as possible to make quality RCA cables as it is to make crap BNC cables.

But for off-the-shelf purchases, yes, your Sony buddy is correct.


RE: NX drivers. Use what you have currently. If you have NX, don't upgrade to 6 until NX is supported. If you do decide to purchase the upgrade early for whatever reason and do not plan to install it, please make sure your salesperson knows that you're buying it but not installing it until the drivers are available. This will help our internal pushes.
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Old 01-24-2011, 08:50 PM   #5
JoJo Gunn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrassValley_BH View Post
On RCA vs BNC, some of it is "about the name" - it's kind of like how buying a Mercedes you get (or at least expect) a higher base level of quality compared to buying say, a Nissan.

RCA cables are generally consumer grade, therefore the testing involved and cheaper quality cable is used.

BNC cables, on the other hand, are generally broadcast grade, therefore testing tolerances are more strict and higher quality cable is used, and there is generally more consistency in build (important when you're mixing tens or hundreds of cables).

My point is though, it's not the connector itself. It's everything else. It is just as possible to make quality RCA cables as it is to make crap BNC cables.

But for off-the-shelf purchases, yes, your Sony buddy is correct.


RE: NX drivers. Use what you have currently. If you have NX, don't upgrade to 6 until NX is supported. If you do decide to purchase the upgrade early for whatever reason and do not plan to install it, please make sure your salesperson knows that you're buying it but not installing it until the drivers are available. This will help our internal pushes.
I bought the upgrade from George at EditHD as part of a group purchase.
I will follow through on your suggestion.

Thanks
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Old 01-25-2011, 12:42 AM   #6
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BTW, if you ever need good RCA-ended cables, I have had good dealings with Blue Jeans Cable - you can get quality Canare connectors on quality Belden cable. 10-meter Component run, no problem. :)
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Old 01-25-2011, 02:11 AM   #7
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I'm glad you decided on Edius. The NX is a good card. I have one as well. It is sitting right next to the best card made by Canopus, the Mega Rex. It was supported for 10 years. Amazing, right! That will not happen again.
The NX has been out for several years and is an end of life product now.
As far as why the drivers were put on the backburner?
Well, they were not! The drivers were not even going to be produced. Many of the familiar GV guys stepped in and pushed for the drivers. By that time, the shipping date for Edius 6 was looming and the drivers were scheduled when they could be fit in. Just be glad that they will be coming.

GV is in this for profit. They make money with new and improved software/hardware. The move to HD/SD-SDI is a welcome improvement that I have been requesting since the late 90's. I now have a Storm 3g. It is a very nice card, but it is still not the Rex :)
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Main System: Azrock Z97 Extreme 6, 4790K@4.7Ghz, 32gb ram, Corsair H110, Win10 Pro 64, Samsung 850 pro, E7.5/8.5/E9 on separate SSD drives, HD Spark, Intensity Shuttle, 12tb RAID 0 on backplane ,2 BD, Benq 27 and Hanns-G 28 monitors, CC 2019, GTX 1080ti SC Black.
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Old 01-25-2011, 04:48 PM   #8
JoJo Gunn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
I'm glad you decided on Edius. The NX is a good card. I have one as well. It is sitting right next to the best card made by Canopus, the Mega Rex. It was supported for 10 years. Amazing, right! That will not happen again.
The NX has been out for several years and is an end of life product now.
As far as why the drivers were put on the backburner?
Well, they were not! The drivers were not even going to be produced. Many of the familiar GV guys stepped in and pushed for the drivers. By that time, the shipping date for Edius 6 was looming and the drivers were scheduled when they could be fit in. Just be glad that they will be coming.

GV is in this for profit. They make money with new and improved software/hardware. The move to HD/SD-SDI is a welcome improvement that I have been requesting since the late 90's. I now have a Storm 3g. It is a very nice card, but it is still not the Rex :)
Actually, I bought the Rex card when they first came out! It was perfect. We never had problems with our simple editing needs. When the improved edit software was issued, I was persuaded to upgrade. Grass Valley and the Video Guys recommended the NX card to support the current software. I have been very happy with Canopus! Unfortunately, I see no reason to change the NX card for a newer card. The NX card captures analog and digital. It outputs HD component. Can someone show me where the advantage of SDI lies? Nearly everything I capture today is by firewire.
Is there an advantage of SDI over firewire capture? I THINK it has already been established there is no advantage of SDI output compared to HD component output. I argue this from the position of an expert with three weeks of experience in "technical" as I am an artist not a mechanic (but I am starting to like this technical stuff....keeps my 65 year old brain working).
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Old 01-25-2011, 06:12 PM   #9
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RCA vs. BNC: The RCA was designed to be a low cost connector operating at audio frequencies. It is cheap, easy to produce, and easy to make up cables. And of course, high end models costing $$$$ are available. For most consumor video purposes they are fine, and except for reliability issues can work OK in many professional applications as well.

Keep in mind that RCA cables often make the "hot" conductor before the ground/shield makes contact - with the resulting potential (pun here) for unwanted surges in the system. (Think of the buzz you sometimes hear when conncting an RCA audio input to a stereo system with the volume turnd up.)

The BNC was designed to be a compact, reliable conenctor for RF frequencies. The bayonet aspect helps ensure reliability of connection, and the designed was intended to ensure constant impedance through the connctor, potentially important for applications above, say 10 mHz or so.

For typical SD analog video with short cables, RCA is usually OK. For high bandwidth applications BNC is better.
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Old 01-25-2011, 07:55 PM   #10
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The key word here is bandwidth. Firewire just doesn't do it. It also cannot handle 3gb speeds, hence the name Storm 3g/Elite. That is the reason that SDI has been requested by many, as well as 10bit. The type work that you describe yourself as doing, you just don't require this technology. Firewire is perfectly fine for you. For others, firewire will not
support what they produce. They may use the files but when connecting high end tape or disc recorders, SDI is the preferred method.
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Six Gill DV
www.sgdvtutorials.com
If you own the Tutorials and you need help, PM me.

Vistitle YouTube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMVlxC8Am4qFbkXJRoPAnMQ/videos

Windows 10 Pro up to v.1803 Tweaks for Edius Users
http://sgdvtutorials.com/WIN%2010%20...%20V.2.0.0.pdf

Main System: Azrock Z97 Extreme 6, 4790K@4.7Ghz, 32gb ram, Corsair H110, Win10 Pro 64, Samsung 850 pro, E7.5/8.5/E9 on separate SSD drives, HD Spark, Intensity Shuttle, 12tb RAID 0 on backplane ,2 BD, Benq 27 and Hanns-G 28 monitors, CC 2019, GTX 1080ti SC Black.
Both systems on Gigabit network
Second System: EditHD Ultimax-i7, X58, 980x@3.74, Corsair H80, Win764, 24gb ram, Storm 3g, Samsung 840 Pro 256, 4tb and 6tb RAID 0 on backplane, GTX 980ti Classified, Edius 9, Apple 30", Samsung 24", dual BD.
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