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-   -   Edius and external USB-C SSD drives. (http://forum.grassvalley.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43447)

Liverpool TV 06-07-2019 08:04 PM

Edius and external USB-C SSD drives.
 
Hi.

I recently made a video showing how to put together a cheap external 1TB USB-C SSD drive. I had a few people asking would this be fast enough for video editing, so here's a video that some may find interesting as it shows an Edius edit running from the external drive.

Cheers,
Dave.


ulyssesvideo 06-08-2019 09:10 AM

As I stated in a previous post on here.... when usb 4 becomes available for pc later this year, editing using an external ssd drive will be just about the same as editing with an internal ssd drive. usb 3 was ok when it became available but really became great when portable ssd drives started to become available but when usb 3.1 was available that is where is it became so much better.
usb 4 when available.... will be fantastic for 6k or 8k footage provided that the portable ssd drive is usb4 compatible for max speed transfer and that your using excellent codecs like all-intra... and that your not using too many effects on the clips that requires extra processing from the computer.

thanks

Liverpool TV 06-08-2019 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulyssesvideo (Post 321386)
As I stated in a previous post on here.... when usb 4 becomes available for pc later this year, editing using an external ssd drive will be just about the same as editing with an internal ssd drive. usb 3 was ok when it became available but really became great when portable ssd drives started to become available but when usb 3.1 was available that is where is it became so much better.
usb 4 when available.... will be fantastic for 6k or 8k footage provided that the portable ssd drive is usb4 compatible for max speed transfer and that your using excellent codecs like all-intra... and that your not using too many effects on the clips that requires extra processing from the computer.

thanks

USB 4 won't make one bit of difference compared to the drive in this video.

ulyssesvideo 06-08-2019 02:56 PM

I think you better read up on usb 4 buddy. much MUCH faster than use 3 or 3.1...
USB 4 is capable of speeds reaching 40 gigabits per second.
in regards to your video... usb 3 is more than plenty to handle simple editing as demonstrated on your video.
thanks

Liverpool TV 06-08-2019 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulyssesvideo (Post 321401)
I think you better read up on usb 4 buddy. much MUCH faster than use 3 or 3.1...
USB 4 is capable of speeds reaching 40 gigabits per second.

thanks

I think you need to read up more as it would appear that you don't understand the speeds of the storage devices and the bus speeds of the interfaces.

For anyone else who is interested in the numbers.

SATA 3 has a max uncoded data rate/bandwidth of 600MB/s

USB-C is minimum of Gen 1 which is 5Gb/s or is usually Gen 2 which is 10Gb/s

The fastest SATA 3 SSD will burst upto 550MB/s and sustain at a lower rate

The drive in this test sustains at about 440MB/s

Both 550MB/s and 440MB/s are lower than the minimum Gen 1 speed of USB-C

Therefore, using a faster bus, such as USB 4, with a SATA 3 SSD will not make any difference what so ever compared to using a SATA 3 SSD in a USB-C enclosure as far as maximum data rate/bandwidth with the SSD is concerned. Because the maximum data rate/bandwidth of the SSD doesn't exceed USB-C anyway.

This is why I said USB 4 won't make one bit of difference compared to the drive in this video.

ulyssesvideo 06-08-2019 03:46 PM

if you buy a proper usb 4 ssd portable drive (not in a cradle) when available connected to a card designed for usb4 that connects directly into the motherboard... I think it will out perform your config....
at the end of the day.. its getting faster and better.... and your current setup in that video.. will be out of date.
yeah.. your right.... may not make ANY different in speed if you refer your video. your only right about that! ... but as video files get larger ie 6k or 8k etc... you will want a faster connection... and your config in that video may struggle a tad.

thanks

BernH 06-08-2019 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulyssesvideo (Post 321407)
if you buy a proper usb 4 ssd portable drive (not in a cradle) when available connected into a card designed for usb4 that connects directly into the motherboard... I think it will out perform your config....
at the end of the day.. its getting faster and better.... and your current setup in that video.. will be out of date.
yeah.. your right.... may not make ANY different in speed if you refer your video... but as video files get larger ie 6k or 8k etc... you will want a faster connection... yours wont cut it that well.

thanks

It will only perform better if the actual drive in the housing can provide the bandwidth.

Regardless of the 40Gb/s theoretical limit of the bus, unless the bus can be saturated by the device, you are not running at the maximum speed of the bus.

If the bus is faster than a single device, splitting the bandwidth across multiple devices can allow for bus saturation (ie. RAID-0 configuration with drives)

You have to remember, "a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link" In this case the single SSD speed is the weakest link. To saturate 40Gb/s you would need a much faster drive than is currently available, or an array of multiple drives.

Liverpool TV 06-08-2019 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ulyssesvideo (Post 321407)
if you buy a proper usb 4 ssd portable drive (not in a cradle) when available connected to a card designed for usb4 that connects directly into the motherboard... I think it will out perform your config....
at the end of the day.. its getting faster and better.... and your current setup in that video.. will be out of date.
yeah.. your right.... may not make ANY different in speed if you refer your video. your only right about that! ... but as video files get larger ie 6k or 8k etc... you will want a faster connection... and your config in that video may struggle a tad.

thanks

You questioned my comment when I said that USB 4 would make no difference what so ever to my drive example saying I need to read up on USB 4.

As I've just proven, USB 4 will indeed make no difference what so ever with regard my drive example and the use with Edius.

You were wrong and all you've done is proven your lack of understanding of such things.

Maybe you should think twice next time and just leave a thread for what it is, an example for other Edius users who have an interest in such things.

If you'd like to comment about the example itself and the obvious advantages to Edius users, fair enough.

Liverpool TV 06-08-2019 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BernH (Post 321408)
It will only perform better if the actual drive in the housing can provide the bandwidth.

Regardless of the 40Gb/s theoretical limit of the bus, unless the bus can be saturated by the device, you are not running at the maximum speed of the bus.

If the bus is faster than a single device, splitting the bandwidth across multiple devices can allow for bus saturation (ie. RAID-0 configuration with drives)

You have to remember, "a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link" In this case the single SSD speed is the weakest link. To saturate 40Gb/s you would need a much faster drive than is currently available, or an array of multiple drives.

Thank you Bern.

And by extension, and as you've pointed out, a single SATA 3 SSD won't saturate the USB-C bus. Therefore no gain what so ever in using USB 4 or any other transport/bus system with a higher bit rate/bandwidth beyond that of the storage medium.

Plus. My example is something that can be done right now and not waiting for a new USB standard that won't make any difference to this example and will require at the very least the expense of a new interface card, although likely a new M/B and whatever else will be needed, enclosures etc.

Honestly, this example was for Edius users interested in such things and it's a proper real world example. Why do some people feel the need to attack a thread, especially when they are obviously ignorant to the technology being used ?

Anyway, thanks again Bern.

Cheers,
Dave.

ulyssesvideo 06-08-2019 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BernH (Post 321408)
It will only perform better if the actual drive in the housing can provide the bandwidth.

Regardless of the 40Gb/s theoretical limit of the bus, unless the bus can be saturated by the device, you are not running at the maximum speed of the bus.

If the bus is faster than a single device, splitting the bandwidth across multiple devices can allow for bus saturation (ie. RAID-0 configuration with drives)

You have to remember, "a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link" In this case the single SSD speed is the weakest link. To saturate 40Gb/s you would need a much faster drive than is currently available, or an array of multiple drives.

yes.. as I said.. when you have a proper usb4 portable drive.. it will be designed to read/write at speeds upto 40Gb/s or there about... samsung makes great usb3 and 3.1 drives and will be making usb4 drives as well.


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