HDStorm VS NXExpress

[tuyle]

This advantage of NX Express hasn't been mentioned anywhere lately:

Component out is BNC.

Not a biggie though.

It's the same for NX PCIe Expansion board. However it will need BNC-RCA connectors to use component cables for LCD TV (which has RCA component input). Unless using pro/broadcast monitor (BNC to BNC)

[Jerry]

OK, thank you all for the supplied information. The HDstorm it will be...As Im not editing on a professional base, I think the HQ codec will offer me more than enough if I plan to change to HD.

That was the little bit of information that was missing. If you are going that route, make sure to get the HDSTORM+ version. That will give you all you will ever need based on your editing description.

[STORMDAVE]

This advantage of NX Express hasn't been mentioned anywhere lately:

Component out is BNC.

Not a biggie though.

[fluppe85]

OK, thank you all for the supplied information. The HDstorm it will be...As Im not editing on a professional base, I think the HQ codec will offer me more than enough if I plan to change to HD.

[Jerry]

But in this case, it would rely on the CPU for the capturing? Or isn't that the big deal anymore with PCs nowadays? I ask this because I've found following text: The onboard hardware DV codec, featured with Canopus realtime DV editing solutions, relieves the CPU from handling the processor-intensive task of rendering DV output without limiting the number of realtime video streams and effects capabilities .When used in OHCI mode, EDIUS’ DV processing is purely software-based, which utilizes valuable CPU power. This usage of the CPU can reduce the realtime playback capabilities of effects and multi-track edits and as such, editors may have to render sequences more frequently, if only to preview a composition. A Canopus realtime DV editing card overcomes this performance hit with onboard hardware DV processing, increasing the editing power of EDIUS systems. (text in conjunction with DVstorm 2)
This let me presume there should be some advantage using firewire on NX. Sorry about all these questions, but i will not be disappointed after buying one of the cards.

If DV capture is your issue, both will do the same. If you capture by way of firewire you will be doing either .m2t or dv. HDMI capture allows for 1920x1080 capture with the HQ codec with the HDSTORM. This is a plus. My discussion with Brandon involves the restriction of having to use the HQ codec and not being able to capture to other codecs or uncompressed.

I'm sorry if I confused you about the 2 cards. You have to decide if the restriction of HQ ingest only with HDMI is an issue. DV capture is the same by way of your onboard firewire input by way of E5. If I was purchasing a new card at this point in time, and I did not need other codec options for ingest, I would go with the HDSTORM+. It is just that simple.

[GrassValley_BH]

Capturing DV and HDV is a simple data transfer over Firewire, like copying a file.

Rendering effects actually hasn't used the hardware DV codec for a long time. All is done in CPU, so there's really no difference between using the NX Firewire port or motherboard or add-in card Firewire port. That's why there's no Firewire port on the HDSTORM - most people already have a Firewire port and it would be redundant.

[fluppe85]

You can still capture DV and HDV in EDIUS using any OHCI-compliant Firewire interface, you just can't capture it through the HDSTORM.

But in this case, it would rely on the CPU for the capturing? Or isn't that the big deal anymore with PCs nowadays? I ask this because I've found following text: The onboard hardware DV codec, featured with Canopus realtime DV editing solutions, relieves the CPU from handling the processor-intensive task of rendering DV output without limiting the number of realtime video streams and effects capabilities .When used in OHCI mode, EDIUS’ DV processing is purely software-based, which utilizes valuable CPU power. This usage of the CPU can reduce the realtime playback capabilities of effects and multi-track edits and as such, editors may have to render sequences more frequently, if only to preview a composition. A Canopus realtime DV editing card overcomes this performance hit with onboard hardware DV processing, increasing the editing power of EDIUS systems. (text in conjunction with DVstorm 2)
This let me presume there should be some advantage using firewire on NX. Sorry about all these questions, but i will not be disappointed after buying one of the cards.

[tuyle]

Before I didn't but these previous posts of Jerry are just confusing me I think.

Why should he come up with the HQ hardware encoder, anyway? What's the reason the website doesn't specifically mentions the video formats for capturing and output like Canopus DV, Canopus lossless, HDV, DV/DVCAM.

As I understand, there is no more hardware based SD MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 export possibility. What's the consequence of that?

For the moment I need a system to go with (mini)DV as input and mostly DVD (MPEG-2) and/or back to camcorder as output. Real-time monitoring will be on an analogue old Tv. Also I will be able to capture my old VHS movies. Besides that, I probably will change to a High definition camcorder within a year and a half, max 2y. So What would be the best choice. I see MPEG encoding could also be done by cards as the Firecoder(?).

As for SD, the software encoder is faster than real time (from timeline to mpeg file). Therefore you don't need to pay for a hardware encoder.

If you need to capture old VHS movies, you can use the NX card and use Y/C for better quality than composite input.

[GrassValley_BH]

What's the reason the website doesn't specifically mentions the video formats for capturing and output like Canopus DV, Canopus lossless, HDV, DV/DVCAM.

Because currently at least, capture using the HDSTORM is in Canopus HQ format only. You can still capture DV and HDV in EDIUS using any OHCI-compliant Firewire interface, you just can't capture it through the HDSTORM.

As I understand, there is no more hardware based SD MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 export possibility. What's the consequence of that?

SD MPEG-2 encoding actually is better quality and faster using software nowadays. SD MPEG-4 export wasn't very popular.

For the moment I need a system to go with (mini)DV as input and mostly DVD (MPEG-2) and/or back to camcorder as output. Real-time monitoring will be on an analogue old Tv. Also I will be able to capture my old VHS movies.

Unless you want to capture your analog and just write it back to DV tape without changes, I would go with HDSTORM Plus (so you get the bay for analog connectivity). Canopus HQ is better quality than DV anyway.

[fluppe85]

Is there a specific reason you can't or don't want to use on-board Firewire or an OHCI Firewire card for DV capture?

Before I didn't but these previous posts of Jerry are just confusing me I think.

Why should he come up with the HQ hardware encoder, anyway? What's the reason the website doesn't specifically mentions the video formats for capturing and output like Canopus DV, Canopus lossless, HDV, DV/DVCAM.

As I understand, there is no more hardware based SD MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 export possibility. What's the consequence of that?

For the moment I need a system to go with (mini)DV as input and mostly DVD (MPEG-2) and/or back to camcorder as output. Real-time monitoring will be on an analogue old Tv. Also I will be able to capture my old VHS movies. Besides that, I probably will change to a High definition camcorder within a year and a half, max 2y. So What would be the best choice. I see MPEG encoding could also be done by cards as the Firecoder(?).

[GrassValley_BH]

Is there a specific reason you can't or don't want to use on-board Firewire or an OHCI Firewire card for DV capture?

[fluppe85]

Onboard Canopus HQ hardware encoder for fast, high-quality capture and export of video to Canopus HQ AVI files

So a combination of both NX and HDstorm would be the best solution. Are there other additional GV cards who can take the hardware capturing of DV?

[GrassValley_BH]

@fluppe85:
You can capture DV and HDV through your normal Firewire port.

@Jerry:
I agree that non-HQ capture is desired, especially as it's a loss of functionality coming from NX. The engineers haven't said it's impossible, but they also haven't given us a timeframe on enabling it yet either.

As for 10-bit, 10-bit is more data, so it would likely require a larger buffer, which would require different board hardware unless it's already accounted for, which I would guess is not due to cost optimizations. So my best guess is that 10-bit hardware support would have to be a future card, followed closely by 10-bit support in EDIUS.

[Jerry]

What do you mean with this? That I wouldn't be able to capture DV?

You can judge for yourself.

http://desktop.thomsongrassvalley.co...TORM/index.php

Onboard Canopus HQ hardware encoder for fast, high-quality capture and export of video to Canopus HQ AVI files



Onboard Encoding Resolutions (Canopus HQ)

1920 x 1080
1440 x 1080(1920 2/3 pixel aspect ratio)
1280 x 1080 (1920 3/4 pixel aspect ratio)
1280 x 720
960 x 720 (1280 2/3 pixel aspect ratio)
720 x 576
720 x 480

Actually, HQ instead of DV, is an improvement.


Brandon can be more specific as to pure DV capture. I'm not reading it on the page at all.

[Jerry]

AFAIK, there is no "ADVC mode" on the HDSTORM, as it's oriented more toward HD.

With the bay, you gain HD Component input and still have HD Component output.

HDSTORM is the way to go unless you really have no intention of going to HDMI or you really NEED the ADVC mode or you have some other strange attachment to something the NX has. Not sure if/when non-HQ format capture will be available on HDSTORM though.

Brandon,
Being restricted to HQ is a little limiting for such a sophisticated piece of hardware. Especially since HDMI can capture full raster HD uncompressed.
If and when we get a 10bit HQ codec, would this onboard chip be able to be
upgraded to handle the 10bit HQ by way of firmware updates? I'm guessing that would be pure speculation on your part.

Jerry