Fastest System for Edius...?

[Bassman]

Hello,

I am on the brink of my HD upgrade (trying to hold out for as long as possible!) and I wanted to ask some questions about my editing system.

I have an NX Express card and will setup a RAID 5 over E-SATA along with Eduis Broadcast, so I am concentrating on the actual computer specs.

This upcoming Flash XDR device has caught my attention which allows recording of higher bitrate material, in 4:2:2.

Sounds great but this has me worried about what is needed on the backend to keep Edius sailing along as it does for me now.

So, I what would I want to have in order to work with 50 Mbps 4:2:2 mpeg-2 source material, maybe two cameras?

Does this call for multiple processors or will a quad-core handle the job?

I will be using good old Windows XP for the OS.

Thanks for your help!

[Jerry]

Hello,

I am on the brink of my HD upgrade (trying to hold out for as long as possible!) and I wanted to ask some questions about my editing system.

I have an NX Express card and will setup a RAID 5 over E-SATA along with Eduis Broadcast, so I am concentrating on the actual computer specs.

This upcoming Flash XDR device has caught my attention which allows recording of higher bitrate material, in 4:2:2.

Sounds great but this has me worried about what is needed on the backend to keep Edius sailing along as it does for me now.

So, I what would I want to have in order to work with 50 Mbps 4:2:2 mpeg-2 source material, maybe two cameras?

Does this call for multiple processors or will a quad-core handle the job?

I will be using good old Windows XP for the OS.

Thanks for your help!

You might want to look at Antons specs on his new computer.

Until the Flash device is released, I wouldn't get ahead of myself. Those cameras also have to have HDSDI out to input into the flash device. They also said an HDMI version is coming later. At $5,000, on top of the cameras, I think the EX1 looks pretty good at 35mbs and everything is built in. I saw the Flash device at NAB. It was an empty box. It will mount on the back of a camera but I think by the time they release it other companies will be well on the way to making it cheaper. To record to uncompressed 1920x1080 would be an extra cost on top of the $5,000.

[Bassman]

I appreciate your thoughts, but I am trying to get a feel for how much processing is needed for a higher than HDV level of editing, and maybe 4:2:2 in the mix as well.

I have only edited DV on my DVStorm2, so I would like some input before I commit to an upgrade path.

Anton has two Xeon processors? How much more does this give you over a dual core flavor?

BTW, uncompressed often gets mentioned when I bring up the Flash XDR. I have no intention of using uncompressed footage. As I mentioned, 50 Mbps Mpeg-2.

Thanks

[STORMDAVE]

The Penryn X5400 Xeon (If you go 2 CPU's) series processors are the fastest currently available. But how much EDIUS uses is up in the air. I think it's kind of overkill for HDV work....I do motion design and After Effects uses all my 8 cores so this is the reason that I have a fast machine.

[Vidsmith66]

Well if money is not an issue, I'm really liking my new 8 core turnkey system from 1 beyond. Running edius broadcast with all the extras, in my initial tests it handles everything up to uncompressed HD and is pretty fast when working with HDV, the only thing I've found to slow it down was trying to edit native avchd files without converting to canopus hq but expected this as avchd is extremely compressed to begin with. am including a pdf about the 8 core system.

[Jerry]

I appreciate your thoughts, but I am trying to get a feel for how much processing is needed for a higher than HDV level of editing, and maybe 4:2:2 in the mix as well.

I have only edited DV on my DVStorm2, so I would like some input before I commit to an upgrade path.

Anton has two Xeon processors? How much more does this give you over a dual core flavor?

BTW, uncompressed often gets mentioned when I bring up the Flash XDR. I have no intention of using uncompressed footage. As I mentioned, 50 Mbps Mpeg-2.

Thanks

Anton has dual quad core processors. In some instances, encoding...not editing, 2 dual cores work more efficiently than 1 quad.

[LightPrism]

Until the Flash device is released, I wouldn't get ahead of myself. Those cameras also have to have HDSDI out to input into the flash device. They also said an HDMI version is coming later. At $5,000, on top of the cameras, I think the EX1 looks pretty good at 35mbs and everything is built in. I saw the Flash device at NAB. It was an empty box. It will mount on the back of a camera but I think by the time they release it other companies will be well on the way to making it cheaper. To record to uncompressed 1920x1080 would be an extra cost on top of the $5,000.

Re: the reference made that the XDR available for handling at NAB "08 was "...an empty box"
Per Mike Schell of Convergent Design:
"The box we showed at NAB was complete, except for one user interface board, which adds very little weight."

As far as other offerings of a device with the format quality capabilities of the XDR, those that I have seen or read about are either still in the concept stage (Cineform concept) or are much more expensive, heavier, larger, consume much more power. They are far less portable. And all require very expensive recording media and readers/VTR's vs. the inexpensive and widely available CF cards and CF readers. Just think about the cost (either purchased or rented) of a VTR capable of capturing in these format qualities.
The only $ comparable scheme to the XDR is still the HD/SDI capture card, fast computer, and fast disc array.

But until a device ships, no fully factual decisions can be made. The XDR boards are already in production and the XDR's are supposed to ship this month or July.

[Bassman]

Let me approach it this way:

If I have a mid-level quad core processor, plenty of RAM, a RAID disc array and a NX Express -

What can I expect when editing:

XDCAM HD 35Mbps 4:2:0

DVCPRO HD 100 Mbps 4:2:2

MPEG-2 50Mbps 4:2:2 long GOP

Mpeg-2 100Mbps 4:2:2 long GOP

OR, any of these converted to Canopus HQ


How important is processing power when the footage actually is less compressed with the higher bitrates?

Thanks

[GrassValley_BH]

The lesser the data compression (and therefore the less complex the data compression is), the less CPU power is required to decode it.

That's why Canopus HQ is larger and requires less CPU power to decode but more storage bandwidth compared to something like HDV or AVCHD, both of which require more CPU power and less storage bandwidth.

[Jerry]

Re: the reference made that the XDR available for handling at NAB "08 was "...an empty box"
Per Mike Schell of Convergent Design:
"The box we showed at NAB was complete, except for one user interface board, which adds very little weight."

But until a device ships, no fully factual decisions can be made. The XDR boards are already in production and the XDR's are supposed to ship this month or July.

This is way off topic but since my post was in that let me say this:

If the box was complete why was it not demonstrated?
Why did it not turn on and off? Even the person showing the item
said it was not ready to demonstrate.
I will look at it again when it ships.

[Bassman]

The lesser the data compression (and therefore the less complex the data compression is), the less CPU power is required to decode it.

Thanks,

So the mid-level Intel quad-core CPU would be able to handle all of those bitrates?

The storage bandwidth seems to be the area where all of the speed needs to be?

[GrassValley_BH]

So the mid-level Intel quad-core CPU would be able to handle all of those bitrates?

The storage bandwidth seems to be the area where all of the speed needs to be?

Well, the higher the resolution, the more CPU power is necessary as well, since there are more pixels to process. This is why AVC-Intra 100 is still harder to deal with than DVCPRO-HD/DVCPRO100 even though they're the same bitrate.

In general as long as you have a sufficiently-wide storage interface (eSATA, etc) then increasing storage bandwidth is easier than increasing CPU power - and less intrusive (external RAID, etc).

If you intend to use filters, multiple layers, etc then you'll definitely want to get a good amount of CPU power, unless you have time to render. It all depends on your workflow.

[Bassman]

O.K.Thanks.

Can you tell me where the mid-level Intel dual core chips fall into the spectrum?

I am trying to find out what would be considered good enough all the way to screaming fast so I know what to buy or build a system around.

I usually put sharpening, white balance and maybe a YUV filter on my footage.

Thanks!

[GrassValley_BH]

Unfortunately I really can't give you a definite good/no-good...

At the end of the day, it ends up being the full system and what it can or can't do.

I'd check with what others have and what they're doing to get a better feel.

[Bassman]

Thanks.

That's what I am trying to do with this thread.