Best HD camera (under $6,000)

[STORMDAVE]

It'd be interesting to see if Panasonic will do 1/2" CCD's with AVC-Intra 100 support (4:2:2) next year in the HVX200 form factor. The Sony EX looks nice, but it's one ugly camera (What's with the rear? Or was that a prototype).

I think we're going to invest in a smaller camera (non HDV) next year. Can't wait 'till NAB08

[RonnieMartin]

Got one on order. Well at least I have put a deposit down to reserve one.

Ronnie

[kwshaw1]

The Sony EX looks nice, but it's one ugly camera (What's with the rear? Or was that a prototype).

I think that's just the way it looks...but what's important is the quality of the images it will produce. So far it seems promising in that regard.

[JPowell]

Me, I would buy six of the Sanyo Xacti HD1000's. heh heh...

Not really, but they did shoot a music video with one (or two) of them:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=8g6P5L7pD5E

I wouldn't say the video looks particularly good or bad for a music video, but the camera looks great for fun and vacation video. Forget editing it, just plug it up to your HDTV with the HDMI-out and enjoy.

Professionally, I really like what I've seen of the Canon A1 for its image quality and resolution (and price). I've also edited some material shot with the JVC HD-110/250 and those cameras make very nice pictures as well, albeit only 720p.

Probably the biggest drawback that I have read about the Canon cams is that their flavor of 24f can't be played back in *any* deck currently, only in Canon camcorders.

[emmanuel_f]

I've been shooting with two A-1 canon's for the past six months, Burning Blu-ray's for three weeks, They look very very good, Standard DVD's look better than what I was doing with my Sony DSR-300's...PS you could get almost two for six grand!!!. Gary

Gary,

with all due respect your comments re the A-1 vs the DSR-300 is a little qustionable. Maybe you can elaborate about the comment "look better than what I was doing with my Sony DSR-300's". Try using the two cameras in a low light, maybe candle lit wedding reception, without gain and maybe a 20w light at the most. If you still believe the A-1 looks better.... you may not be using the 300 properly.

[kwshaw1]

I heard several months ago that B&H stopped taking DSR-300s for resale because so many people were trading them in for HDV cameras...

[Khoi Pham]

Gary,

with all due respect your comments re the A-1 vs the DSR-300 is a little qustionable. Maybe you can elaborate about the comment "look better than what I was doing with my Sony DSR-300's". Try using the two cameras in a low light, maybe candle lit wedding reception, without gain and maybe a 20w light at the most. If you still believe the A-1 looks better.... you may not be using the 300 properly.

I'm not Gary, but I have been shooting ENG type camera 4ever, way before digital age, and I do know how to use them, he is right, even low light candle lit wedding reception, IF you know how to use the A1, it is better than DSR300 when using final SD DVD as a comparison, and even as good as original footage shot from DSR570 which is even a bigger chip camera than the DSR300, but if you want to compare original footage from DSR300 and A1 footage and HD on Blu ray as final delivery then that is not even a comparison at all, I was using DSR300 for 3 years and often rented the DSR570, I bought the FX1 and Z1 and did real life comparison for 5 weddings then I sold both of my DSR300 and VX2000 and got all Sony HDV, now I'm using all A1 and it is even better, the new Sony should be even better cuz it is 1/2 inch chips, but I'm not going to touch that until the memory stick get really cheap. Technology is moving fast, you can't think that just because the DSR300 has professional lens and is a professional camera and cost 3 times as much should has better PQ than and prosumer HDV but it is not, yeah it is brighter under low light, it has shalower DOF but that is all it got, I'm not missing the brighter picture under low light, brighter does not mean better, I only missed the DOF of the DSR300 and 570.
Now about the gain, DSR300 is grainy at 6db or above, that is why you said don't use gain with HDV camera, but HDV camera gain is clean, even when it is so dark that you have to use high gain and it might look grainy with HDV but by the time you downconvert it to SD MPEG2, most of the grain is gone, here is an example, open up a 1920X1080 file with white background in photoshop, put a 1 pixel black dot in the middle, now resize it to 720X480 and see if you can find that black dot, it is very hard, same thing happen with grain on HDV original footage that you have to downconvert to SD MPEG2. I was pretty ps when I first got the FX1 cuz I can't believe this toy handycam actually has better pict than my trusty bread and butter DSR300 that cost 11 G when I first got it but hey I accepted and move on, don't get stuck behind time, that new Sony 1/2 HD should be one killer bad a.. camera.

[mattmatt]

This thread has been very helpful, thanks again guys :) This is exactly what I was after, real life experiences, not just spec sheets :)

[Martin_Gleeson]

but HDV camera gain is clean, even when it is so dark that you have to use high gain and it might look grainy with HDV but by the time you downconvert it to SD MPEG2, most of the grain is gone, here is an example, open up a 1920X1080 file with white background in photoshop, put a 1 pixel black dot in the middle, now resize it to 720X480 and see if you can find that black dot, it is very hard, same thing happen with grain on HDV original footage that you have to downconvert to SD MPEG2.

Is this not because the downconvert softens the picture so much?

[Khoi Pham]

Is this not because the downconvert softens the picture so much?

Nope, I think you are confusing clean versus noisy, some people thinks that picture with a little bit of noise is sharp, and when they look at the same picture with less noise they think it is soft, when I look at my SD DVD made from DSR300, it is alot more noisy and the edge is broken up, SD DVD from A1 is clean and smooth and the edge is tight and sharp. I know you are not happy with your A1s, maybe you are just not use to looking at a clean picture, I don't know.

[mcity]

HDV is OK unless there is no so much fast action or fast object movement and or
fast movement of camera, the DVD made out of of HDV is better than DVD originated in SD. But in above said situation the visuals tends to deteriorate.


Rajiv.

[fukly]

hi guys...
sorry to interrupt..has anyone try HVR HD1000??
i'm planning to buy 1 unit this week for my backup camera...it looks pro,i know it got only 1 cmos and a 'stupid'design of the lcd touch screen menu for the manual shutter-iris-focus ring..... i've heard an issue that it has a bad performance in low light condition.
is it true? i'm expecting comments from the one has used it...
tx.

[Jerry]

You might want to take a look at the new PMW-EX1 XDCAM, its going to be in the neighborhood of $6K, just do a web search for it, you will find plenty info

I would wait until they get the vignetting problem fixed. Other than that, it looks like an incredible camera for the price.

[ChrisFar]

I have to jump in here as a DSR300 owner. I own 3 DSR300A's I routinely gain them up to 9db in dark reception halls and I have very little grain. The image quality has always been fantastic. I also have owned the vx2000, pd-150, and currently use the dvx100a. The smaller cameras can not hold a candle in low light to the 300A's.
Chris

[STORMDAVE]

I have to jump in here as a DSR300 owner. I own 3 DSR300A's I routinely gain them up to 9db in dark reception halls and I have very little grain. The image quality has always been fantastic. I also have owned the vx2000, pd-150, and currently use the dvx100a. The smaller cameras can not hold a candle in low light to the 300A's.
Chris

Lower end HD cameras have grain issues because the camera manufacturers are trying to cram in cheap CCD's (or CMOS) into a tiny form factor and cheaper prices...it should improve in the future with small cameras such as the EX1, but nobody should expect the quality to rival a 2/3" chip high end DVCPROHD or an HDCAM camcorder. The gap is still pretty large.