An EASY way to redo color grading of Multi-cam AFTER compress to track?

[OneQuickSix]

Basically, here is the situation:

I recently finished editing a 5 camera event video shoot. For 4 out of 5 cams, I was using identical and/or very similar cameras ... all dialed-in exactly the same. NO problem there of course other than some minor adjustments due to perceived exposure.

However, a 5th camera was a little cheapo HD cam I put up in the lighting/mixing booth to have a perspective and a possible "audience fill-in" time-lapse. Turns out it captured some decent footage and a nice perspective for when the stage was really packed. Unfortunately, being a cheapo cam it blew out the highlights and was just REALLY hard to match to the other cams.

Anyway, I got it dialed in as best I could (or so I thought) then did my multi-cam edits, refinements, and then compressed to a single track to do my dissolve choices, etc. However, I later figured out a way to color-correct it even more in line with the other cams.

The problem is, as far as I can tell, there is no EASY way to apply (or remove then apply really) the CC to all of the clips at once. Going through the single track and finding and CTRL-clicking all the instances is out of the question. So is selecting them all on the original track (much easier, just lasso the whole line of course) and then re-compressing to a new track again, as I will lose all of the things I did on the compressed track.

Be nice if there was a "search and select" function ... that would work quite nicely. Any ideas? Maybe I'm missing some extraordinary function of Edius that everyone else knows about but me? Here's to hoping!

Thanks!

[antonsvideo]

if you ctrl+click the track header of the track that holds the bad camera, all clips will be highlighted, then Alt+F will remove all filters

then add the new replacement filter to the first clip, save it as user preset and then delete from clip

then use ctrl+click on the track header again and drop the user preset, done

I can also do it without creating a user preset but it is a bit tricky to explain in typing

[OneQuickSix]

Thanks, Anton ... but what you described I already know how to do (and did many a time) -- although I have to do it the other way you alluded to, as I am on 6.06. (CTRL-Clicking the track header does not highlight all clips is 6.06).

I think you missed the part about how I need to do this AFTER compressing (and editing that compressed track with dissolves, etc.) to single track from multi-cam edit. I don't exactly blame you for missing it, as the post was a bit long-winded. :)

So, with THAT in mind, is there an easy way? Thanks.


-Tim

[antonsvideo]

well, uncompressing the track should be a simple click to get it back to multicam, or is this not working for you?

once back in multicam, delete the compressed track, then do what I mentioned earlier

and sorry, I meant Ctrl+A after selecting track header

[OneQuickSix]

As I said, sure I can get it "back" to multicam (F8) and delete the compressed track, then make a new one. But the problem is, then you lose anything and everything you've done to the compressed track (i.e. fades/transitions, etc).

It does keep any changes to the cuts of course, but redoing the other stuff is not really an option ... I'd rather leave the CC alone at this point. Which is looking like my only choice. Other than going through and finding each one in the compressed track and doing the tried-and-true methods, but this is 2 hours of cuts, don't have time (and probably the patience) for that either. Again, a "find and select" would be a really nice feature for these situations.

Edit: PS> Ahh, yes, of course, CTRL-A ... yes that of course works in 6.06.

[Liverpool TV]

It looks like a manual time line effort. You could just watch it from beginning to end and drop chapter markers in real time on your shots that need looking at. Then go back to the chapter markers and alter the clips accordingly. It would only take two hours, which is less time than waiting for replies on the forum, if you are up against the clock. I use this method myself in a different scenario, not compressed multi tracks. And aside from obviously being boring, it does work and also gives you the chance to check the edit for errors. Maybe try it out right at the end, so you can kill two birds, check the edit and ID the cuts.

[OneQuickSix]

It looks like a manual time line effort. You could just watch it from beginning to end and drop chapter markers in real time on your shots that need looking at. Then go back to the chapter markers and alter the clips accordingly. It would only take two hours, which is less time than waiting for replies on the forum, if you are up against the clock. I use this method myself in a different scenario, not compressed multi tracks. And aside from obviously being boring, it does work and also gives you the chance to check the edit for errors. Maybe try it out right at the end, so you can kill two birds, check the edit and ID the cuts.

Yeah, I realize that of course ... and I just don't have the time. The edit has been "fine-tooth-combed" to death. I LITERALLY have the play memorized ... no joke. I am ALWAYS multi-tasking ... the beauty of putting up a thread is two-fold:

1. If someone knows of a solution, great! While I am working on other stuff I can learn the "new trick" and be so much the better off for it.
   
2. For the future ... if someone has a solution, but it comes days (weeks, or months later), I sure wouldn't mind knowing about it for next time.

Ohhh, three-fold I guess, heh-heh ...

3. If there is not a solution, than this is a definite feature request for a (hopefully) near-future release of Edius.

I'm really kind of surprised there isn't a solution AND that this has never come up before. I'm sure there are many other reasons you would want to go back after a multi-cam cut and change clips on a mass scale without having to comb through them all.

My solution would be, as I mentioned before, a "find and select" feature. Simply type in the name of the clip, and it will highlight every instance on the timeline ... or, optionally/possibly, even a certain track.

Or whatever the engineers -- or other users -- can come up with the alleviate this issue. Maybe an UPDATE TO COMPRESSED TRACK function would be nice ... although it sounds more complicated than my solution from a programming standpoint.

-Tim

[antonsvideo]

here is how I would implement this:

if say camera3 is the badly balanced one, add a filter and correct it and save the filter as a preset called cam3

now delete the filter from the clip and then apply the saved preset cam3

now if you make a change to preset cam3 on any clip (now or in the future), the change will be applied to all clips that have the same cam3 preset applied

[OneQuickSix]

Yeah, good thinking, Anton ... that is a decent work around for the future. I can't think of anything BUT filters at the moment, but I'm not sure what else might be needed (if anything) AFTER an "edit and condense." If the only thing IS filters, than having such a "dummy" preset applied is certainly a decent way of doing it. Very cool.

In fact, you could have FIVE (or more) "dummy presets", and be in the habit of applying one to each camera first thing before you do anything else. Then no matter what, you can adjust any/all of them to your hearts content! In fact, there was a really small tweak to another camera I would have liked to have made, and this would have made it easy.

Thanks for that great idea ... it won't save me this time, but now I am set for future edits. Thanks again!

[beardedboss]

One Thing I do is nest each Camera into it's own sequence before building the main Multi-Cam Sequence.

Say I have 5 Cams, then I make 5 Sequences with for each one, with just 1V and 1A, drag the whole original camera clip into this and do so with each one.

Then I make a Main Source Sequence, where I then bring down each Camera Sequence onto its own track. (5V and 5A)

If you want to see the waveforms of all the Cameras on the Main Source Sequence, then you can copy each one from the Cameras own Sequence then bring it into the Main Source Sequence, remembering to mute the Original Audio in each Sources Cam Sequence afterwards.

If not bothered about seeing wave forms leave it has it is.

I also colour code each camera, (right mouse on clip in Bin> Select Colour) always recommended, that way which ever way you do it, then you can instantly see which camera is which, for instance I have CAM 1, which is always Green, CAM 2 Blue, etc. Even on a heavy compressed track then you expand the timeline and instantly see which camera is which due to the different colours.

Anyway if you do this workflow, you can always go back to the original camera sources sequences and apply a fresh color correction filter in one go, which is what you want to do.

If however it is like me, where you may need to alter one clip to another after compressing the track, put the CTI at the beginning of the timeline expand it to a close up enough view say 2 to 5 secs, then use A and S on the keyboard to jump though the cuts, you should be able to get through a 2 hour show in about 15mins. Like LTVHD says, it is always worth checking through the final edit, watching it through as finished product before committing to encoding, you'll be amazed at how many little bits and pieces you missed or was meant to change during the edit. As they say, in UK, a little saying, "You Can't See The Wood For The Tree's" which means when you have your head stuck on a project and you know every inch of it, then you can become somewhat blind to it. Anyway, hope that helps you!

[Liverpool TV]

One Thing I do is nest each Camera into it's own sequence before building the main Multi-Cam Sequence.

Say I have 5 Cams, then I make 5 Sequences with for each one, with just 1V and 1A, drag the whole original camera clip into this and do so with each one.

Then I make a Main Source Sequence, where I then bring down each Camera Sequence onto its own track. (5V and 5A)

If you want to see the waveforms of all the Cameras on the Main Source Sequence, then you can copy each one from the Cameras own Sequence then bring it into the Main Source Sequence, remembering to mute the Original Audio in each Sources Cam Sequence afterwards.

If not bothered about seeing wave forms leave it has it is.

I also colour code each camera, (right mouse on clip in Bin> Select Colour) always recommended, that way which ever way you do it, then you can instantly see which camera is which, for instance I have CAM 1, which is always Green, CAM 2 Blue, etc. Even on a heavy compressed track then you expand the timeline and instantly see which camera is which due to the different colours.

Anyway if you do this workflow, you can always go back to the original camera sources sequences and apply a fresh color correction filter in one go, which is what you want to do.

If however it is like me, where you may need to alter one clip to another after compressing the track, put the CTI at the beginning of the timeline expand it to a close up enough view say 2 to 5 secs, then use A and S on the keyboard to jump though the cuts, you should be able to get through a 2 hour show in about 15mins. Like LTVHD says, it is always worth checking through the final edit, watching it through as finished product before committing to encoding, you'll be amazed at how many little bits and pieces you missed or was meant to change during the edit. As they say, in UK, a little saying, "You Can't See The Wood For The Tree's" which means when you have your head stuck on a project and you know every inch of it, then you can become somewhat blind to it. Anyway, hope that helps you!

I don't do much multicam myself, but this is a brilliant workflow for prepping your multicam master timeline. This is what I do myself when working with complex composites, but in normal edit mode. Nested sequencing is something that I use all the time, and is quite often overlooked as a creative and fixing aid, and has many uses that are not initially apparent, just as Beardedboss has so excellently pointed out.

[Bassman]

I agree with Anton, in this situation I would make a new filter preset and manually go through and replace the filters on each clip used. Just keep hitting "page down" to jump forward to each timeline event. Yes it will be a little time consuming but you will KNOW it is all done right.

For the future, there are some different ways...

1) I agree about making separate sequences for each camera. I have been doing this for a while and it really cleans up the multicam timeline as all cameras are just one long clip.

2) I go against the grain and never compress my tracks. I know this is not how Edius was supposedly designed, but it just makes more sense to me. You can keep everything on its own tracks and alter things a lot quicker. You can still add transitions. It might take a little more back and forth between mutlicam and single track, but it is just the f12 key. For complex shoots I think it is a better way.

[Ron Evans]

I do mainly 4 or 5 camera theatre plays and know the problem since my cameras are really consumer cameras and unattented for most. As the lighting changes they do change as the response to LED stage lighting from different angles is different. I have come to set the bulk colour correction/YUV before I start editing and fine tune as I edit . I know not a lot of use to you now but maybe useful if you mix cheaper cameras with pro gear. I also use the CTRL+A to change as a block as Anton says. These cameras are not used a lot ( full stage or a fixed angle in case the two manned cameras miss something) so is easy to look at timeline and check if I get a better match later in the edit. Like Bassman I also never compress the multitrack, do simple dissolves using the mixer track as I rarely use anything other than cuts.

Ron Evans

[OneQuickSix]

One Thing I do is nest each Camera into it's own sequence before building the main Multi-Cam Sequence ...

That's a pretty neat idea as well, BB. My only concern would be if Plural Eyes would still work. Guess I can just try it and find out at some point.

... If however it is like me, where you may need to alter one clip to another after compressing the track ...

Ahhh, now there's an example of where my "find and select" (or in that case, a "find and replace") would work out very nicely.

Like LTVHD says, it is always worth checking through the final edit, watching it through as finished product ...

Definitely did that ... as I said, I lost track of how many times I have watched it now, especially with the sound mixes too, and literally have the entire musical memorized. This was not a case of missing something, but rather discovering a way to make something even better. But I know exactly what you mean about being too close ... I also have at least one other neutral party watch it and give me notes. I have one hyper-critical viewer I go to who can always find something, lol.

Thanks for that great tip on the nesting!

-Tim

[OneQuickSix]

... Nested sequencing is something that I use all the time, and is quite often overlooked as a creative and fixing aid, and has many uses that are not initially apparent, just as Beardedboss has so excellently pointed out.

Yes, me too ... I'm primarily a Motion-Graphics artist (90% of work is MoGraph, Animation and Visual Effects, 10% editing) and I use After Effects every day. So naturally, nesting comps is something I do ALL THE TIME.

Even though it's a bit different with Edius, why didn't this occur to me? Still kicking myself over that one. :0

-Tim